Talk:List of compositions by Franz Schubert by genre

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Comment[edit]

Should String Quartet No. 13 (Schubert) be an alias for Rosamunde (as in the quartets section of this article), considering that Rosamunde is only secondarily a reference to the quartet - it refers primarily to the incidental music to the short-lived play? Perhaps (if not String Quartet No. 13 (Schubert) which seems most logical - I should have done that when I started the article on quartet 14, and have created a redirect) Rosamunde Quartet or Rosamunde (quartet) instead... Schissel : bowl listen 03:37, Apr 4, 2005 (UTC)

Proposal: Separate Category for the Songs/Song Cycles[edit]

As articles for more and more of the songs are created, Category:Compositions_by_Franz_Schubert is going to become dominated by the songs. Should a subcategory Category:Songs_and_song_cycles_by_Franz_Schubert (or some variant phrasing of) be created? DavidRF 20:59, 30 January 2007 (UTC)[reply]

Wind octet links errounously to D803[edit]

fixed. THanks. --DavidRF (talk) 14:54, 2 July 2008 (UTC)[reply]

Why is there no mention of the only piece written for flute?[edit]

Variations for Flute and Piano on "Trockne Blumen" from "Die Schone Mullerin"
D 802 —Preceding unsigned comment added by 128.253.68.154 (talk) 23:00, 23 April 2009 (UTC)[reply]

questions about D 814, D 823[edit]

The listing under Piano, four hands currently gives 4 "Ländler" in E-flat major, A-flat major, C minor, C major, D 814. The only copy I have access to, Christoph Eschenbach and Justus Frantz on EMI, agrees with the key of the first three of these, but gives the key of the fourth Landler as being again in A-flat major rather than in C major. Is there any way to confirm this discrepancy one way or the other? Thanks. Milkunderwood (talk) 19:21, 24 March 2011 (UTC)[reply]

At this time I still have no answer yet to whether the fourth Landler is C Major or A-flat major. Milkunderwood (talk) 01:05, 26 March 2011 (UTC)[reply]
The score for these four Ländler is here. No. 4 has no flat markings on the staff at all, unlike No. 2, which has four flats. So I'm guessing that the C major signature is correct after all - but of course would appreciate confirmation. (Music is not "Greek to me" - at least I can puzzle my way through some Greek if I work at it hard enough, but I'm at total loss with music.) Milkunderwood (talk) 22:29, 26 March 2011 (UTC)[reply]

(this section answered):

Also, I'm puzzled by the listings for D 823, shown as:

  • Divertissement on a French motif in B minor, Op. 84, No. 1, D 823
  • Divertissement on a French motif in E minor, Op. 63, No. 1, D 823
  • Divertissement on a French motif in E minor, Op. 84, No. 2, D 823

Again, the Eschenbach/Frantz recording lists all three pieces as being in E minor. And I can't help wondering about the middle piece being Op. 63 rather than Op. 84, unless it's actually a pastiche assembled as such by Deutsch.

Edit: IMSLP gives only D.823 - Divertissement in e for piano duet, and Divertissement à la française, D.823, both entries in the singular, and with no mention of "motifs". Milkunderwood (talk) 20:00, 24 March 2011 (UTC)[reply]

Okay, here's part of the answer. I can't read music and can't decipher the keys, but that second link to IMSLP displays three jpgs of the Breitkopf titles, as follows:

  • Divertissement (en forme d'une Marche brillante et raisonnée) über französische Motive für das Pianoforte zu fier Händen componirt von Franz Schubert. Op. 63. Tempo di marcia. (Breitkopf Serie 9 No. 80)
  • Andantino varié über französische Motive für das Pianoforte zu fier Händen componirt von Franz Schubert. Op. 84 No. 1. Andantino. (Breitkopf Serie 9 No. 81)
  • Rondeau brillante über französische Motive für das Pianoforte zu fier Händen componirt von Franz Schubert. Op. 84 No. 2. Allegretto. (Breitkopf Serie 9 No. 82)

So it looks like Deutsch did cobble these together, apparently based on Breitkopf. Note that each separately specifies "über französische Motive", which is plural - thus on French motifs, not "on a French motif". And Breitkopf does not give "Op. 63, No. 1". Can some musician verify what is the correct key for each of these? Milkunderwood (talk) 05:55, 25 March 2011 (UTC)[reply]

I'm satisfied by the information found at IMSLP, and accordingly have made the appropriate corrections. Milkunderwood (talk) 01:05, 26 March 2011 (UTC)[reply]
According to the IMSLP images, the key markings for D823 above are correct. Magic♪piano 01:22, 26 March 2011 (UTC)[reply]
Wait - by above you mean the Op 84 #1 is in B minor, not E minor? I subsequently found this at IMSLP: "Op.84 - Divertissement sur des motifs originaux francais in e for piano 4 hands, D 823-2 and D 823-3 (only movemants 2 and 3 - movement 1 is: op. 63)", so I assumed that applied to both parts of Op 84 -- and have changed the article to put all three pieces in E minor. If it's actually B minor I'll change it back. Please clarify. Milkunderwood (talk) 03:52, 26 March 2011 (UTC)[reply]
Perhaps I should be a little clearer. The manuscripts for the three items at Divertissement à la française, D.823 each has an opus number in the manuscript. The first, Tempo di Marcia, marked as Opus 63, is in E minor. The second, Andantino variée, Opus 84 #1, is in B minor, and the third, Rondeau Brillant, Opus 84 #2, is in E minor. This is based on looking at the preview images only, except for 84 #1, which I looked at the PDF. Magic♪piano 14:07, 26 March 2011 (UTC)[reply]
Thanks very much - it's fixed now. Milkunderwood (talk) 21:38, 26 March 2011 (UTC)[reply]

Inconsistent listings under Piano - four hands[edit]

Most listings under the same Deutsch number are put together, as

  • 3 Marches Militaires in D major, G major, E-flat major, Op. 51, D 733
  • 4 "Ländler" in E-flat major, A-flat major, C minor, C major, D 814
  • 6 Grandes Marches et Trios in E-flat, G minor, B minor, D major, E-flat major, E major, Op. 40, D 819
  • 6 Polonaises in D minor, F major, B-flat major, D major, A major, E major, Op. 61, D 824
  • 2 Marches Caractéristiques in C major, Op. posth. 121, D 886

but some others are listed individually, as the four separate D 599 Polonaises, which could instead be shown as

  • 4 Polonaises in D minor, B-flat major, E major, F major, Op. 75, D 599

and the three separate D 602 Marches Héroiques, as

  • 3 Marches Héroiques, in B minor, C major, D major, Op. 27, D 602

I don't know which method is preferred, but it would make sense to handle them all the same way.
In any event, this still leaves the problem of the D 823 Divertissements on French motifs, which appear to have differing opus numbers, as I questioned above in the preceding section. Milkunderwood (talk) 04:24, 25 March 2011 (UTC)[reply]

Edit: They are different opus numbers, as now noted above. They are Op. 63; Op. 84 No. 1; and Op. 84 No. 2. Milkunderwood (talk) 06:07, 25 March 2011 (UTC)[reply]
I have gone ahead and consolidated the 4 Polonaises, and the 3 Marches Héroiques; and corrected the Divertissements. Milkunderwood (talk) 01:10, 26 March 2011 (UTC)[reply]

The two piano trios: opus numbers[edit]

I'm certainly no expert on Schubert, but in my experience in cataloging recordings, the two piano trios seem to be referred to by their opus numbers - Op. 99 and Op. 100, respectively - without their Deutsch numbers, at least as frequently as by D. 898 and D. 929. I'm sure there must be some historical reason for this that I'm not aware of, but would be curious to know ...
Milkunderwood (talk) 08:31, 25 September 2011 (UTC)[reply]

No idea. If I had to guess, it's because he only wrote the two large scale ones and there's no confusion like there is with symphonies and piano sonatas. But whatever the case, that doesn't particularly seem relevant this page, per se, which needs to be consistent. ♫ Melodia Chaconne ♫ (talk) 13:39, 25 September 2011 (UTC)[reply]
I understand the need for consistency in the article. I was just thinking that these two pieces are so frequently referred to by their opus numbers alone - for instance, if you use piano trio schubert op 99 or op 100 as your search term, in whatever arrangements of these words, only the You may create the page message comes up with its listings. It seems it would be handier for a user with only the opus number, to find whatever kind of link it is that WP provides for similar cases. (I'm tired, and can't write a decent English sentence.) Milkunderwood (talk) 11:15, 26 September 2011 (UTC)[reply]
Hmmm. Well I just created Piano Trio Op. 99 (Schubert) and Piano Trio Op. 100 (Schubert). Maybe that'll help? ♫ Melodia Chaconne ♫ (talk) 13:58, 26 September 2011 (UTC)[reply]
That does the trick - thanks for getting it done. Milkunderwood (talk) 21:44, 26 September 2011 (UTC)[reply]

Most recent changes[edit]

@Michael Bednarek:,thank you very much for the correction on Tübingen, the image files and the Reference/External Links section. Regarding the other changes, I appreciate your expertise on formatting matters and your will to make these improvements. I would just like to point out, as in the List of Solo Piano Compositions article, that a lot of thought and work was put into creating these bullet lists. Any change has great consequences for the format that was devised for this entire project. That being said, I am aware that some of the issues raised in your revision are due to the fact that the formats used do not conform entirely with the Wikipedia Manual of Style/Music regarding Classical music titles. Please allow me a few days to look into this. I will try to find a suitable solution. Solti79 (talk) 05:48, 6 August 2014 (UTC)[reply]

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