Talk:Backpacking (travel)

backpackbuddies.co.uk

Avast reports as downloading a trojan, anyone know about this? —Preceding unsigned comment added by 124.182.224.72 (talk) 10:11, 5 June 2009 (UTC)

Tagged for NPOV, unreferenced

This article needs work, especially the criticism section. Much of that reads like a personal essay from someone opposed to backpacking. Notable published sources need to be cited for any supposed criticisms. A Wikipedia editor can't simply write his/her opinion in the third person as "some people think this or that." 69.29.130.202 22:54, 20 December 2006 (UTC)

in the spirit of being bold, I don't think the neutrality was any longer in dispute. I was hoping someone else would remove the tag but since no concerns have been raised (yet) about my re-write, I've removed the tag. Feel free to replace it if you don't think the article is yet neutral.Travellingcari 19:26, 5 November 2007 (UTC)

race of backpackers

I deleted this from the "advantages" section "......and are Caucasian (except for the prolific Japanese backpacker tradition)."

I can tell you backpacking (around asia at least) that there are backpackers of many races although they do tend to be nationals of western countries and developed asian countries.

Wording Problems

This page frequents use of phrases like "the majority of" and "most backpackers", without having references that substantiate these generalizations. While accepted generalizations I suppose are permissable, statements like "a majority of backpackers bring high resolution digital cameras" is not, unless it has a study or some form of expert reference. I'm not confident enough in my own revision abilities to clean this page up, but I feel someone ought to at least simplify it to the point where it can be built up from there. May I also suggest that much of the random bickering on this talk page be blanked? DukeOfSquirrels 23:01, 18 February 2007 (UTC)

Still lacking

Perhaps it's time that someone start again on this article? It's a mess. It's too long for a subject that is really only needs two to three paragraphs to describe. Going this much into detail gives us an article that will perpetually be prone to flame and revert wars. Aep 17:08, 27 February 2007 (UTC)

I agree. The article needs an overhaul. -Will Beback · † · 19:31, 27 February 2007 (UTC)

It's been cut down somewhat, but every section in this article can be easily cut down into one or two sentences. It's far too long. Other thoughts?Aep (talk) 09:34, 12 February 2008 (UTC)

Canada?

Please merge this page with Backpacking (Canada)... there is no purpose to a separate article. —The preceding unsigned comment was added by Leif902 (talk • contribs) 23:45, 27 February 2007 (UTC).

LANGUAGE

From experience, usually the predominant language of the area is the main language of travelers in an area. ~~Edwin~~

Hey, is there a measurable amount of african-diaspora (black) backpackers? please don't delete this question!67.176.14.100 02:28, 27 June 2007 (UTC)JF Rocket

provide verifiable references to back your claim. Michellecrisp 02:31, 27 June 2007 (UTC)

Backpacking in fiction

is this section necessary, does not relate entirely to main thrust of article? I'm suggesting deleting this section, or creating its own entry. Michellecrisp 07:13, 23 July 2007 (UTC)

External Links & References

For all the shoddiness of this article and the disputes and complaints it receives, someone sure is over-protective about external links and reference articles. Some non-commercial outside sources might benefit the article, idiot! —Preceding unsigned comment added by 219.79.58.249 (talk) 10:55, August 26, 2007 (UTC)

Thanks for the info man--Ad@m.J.W.C. 12:43, 26 August 2007 (UTC)

To the unsigned...

To the Unsigned commentor... Your ideas would be more appreciated if you were less like one yourself... Michael 22:15, 19 October 2007 (UTC)

Updated Revisions October 2007

I just did a massive re-write. I think it's a lot cleaner and while I know it's not perfect I see it as a massive improvement and hope others agree.

While I took out a lot, I don't think I removed anything crucial. As others have stated, including Aep, it was too long and wasn't central to the discussion.

My concerns on my own update: too scholarly? I tried to get legit sources but I don't know if it's over-cited. I also took out a lot of the "see also"s as I didn't see what car-pooling had to do with backpacking. ClueBot seems to have automatically changed something I did, but I'm not certain what. As always, open to any feedback. Thanks!

ETA: My entire change was removed by ClueBot. I think it thought I was blanking it due to the large change. Off to fix. Fixed! Travellingcari 19:17, 29 October 2007 (UTC)

Good to see someone being bold in the way it was intended. Not entirely sure we should be speaking directly to the reader, but. --Pete 21:12, 29 October 2007 (UTC)

Good job, but I think it still needs to be cut down further. There's a lot of bloat. I'm tempted to editing myself, but I don't want to provoke anyone into a snit. Maybe my past as a newspaper editor is coming through? Aep (talk) 09:36, 12 February 2008 (UTC)

You won't get an edit war from me, I re-wrote the article completely to source it. I'm curious to know what you think should be eliminated, as I don't think it needs to be "only one or two sentences" per section, per your comment below. The article had been a mess so I added significant sourcing. Is it too long kb wise? Otherwise I see no reason to drastically shorten it. Please note that your comment below was responding to a comment from a year ago, older concerns. I'd be happy to change what you'd like, but I don't see a reason to shorten it necessarily. Travellingcari (talk) 12:46, 12 February 2008 (UTC)

criticisms

doesn't say what the criticisms are? that backpackers are perceived as too lazy and scared to get a job? --203.117.92.2 10:08, 5 November 2007 (UTC)

It's one person's belief, I don't think it merits a comment in Wiki about the type of travel. I've never seen that referenced anywhere as even a popular beliefTravellingcari 13:41, 5 November 2007 (UTC)

Backpackers are seen, in Oz at least, as useful sources of labour for fruitpicking etc. --Pete 16:29, 5 November 2007 (UTC)

yep - I know the early hippie-esque backpacking had those connotations but I didn't think it was current perception -- but then again I 've been reading far too many TourismNT reports recentlyTravellingcari 18:48, 5 November 2007 (UTC)

One criticism I can think of is that many backpackers are perceived to be whore-mongering low caste members of some affluent nation who visit the developing world to exploit what they cannot afford at home. Also, as "ambassadors" of their respective homelands, they do little but convey an image of idleness and substandard hygiene.

The First Backpacker

Giovanni Careri? Really? I propose Ibn Battuta. Peraltita (talk) 13:43, 29 January 2008 (UTC)

or Matsuo Bashō as well. The issue with that section is we can name these three and any other contributors could add their own that they're aware of. Personally, I think it should go Travellingcari (talk) 15:08, 29 January 2008 (UTC)

Remains Controversial?

First of all, let me express my appreciation to the people that did the rewrites. They did a good job and I thank them for that. However, I feel the need to add the following perspective.

I am a 51-year old backpacker who first donned a pack in 1968. Backpacking "remains" controversial? Sounds like revsionism to me. No, backpacking did not begin with the "hippie trail". I researched backpacking in the late '60s when I first got into it. The Boy Scout manuals of the day attributed backpacking, at least immediately, to campcraft (of the early 20th century). I remember well, the books of the day had plans for CARVING your own pack frame and SEWING your own canvas bag to fit it. Mr. Kelty had just invented the new-fangled hip belt as a way to transfer back-carried weight to the long bones of the legs. I never carried a wood and canvas pack, but they had only recently been replaced by aluminum and cordura. I've hiked most of N. America and parts of S. America. Backpacking is about being portable and independent - on your own. Americans like to think themselves as independent, but when someone comes along who really IS independent, who has cast off material ties and put themselves OUT there, it freaks them out. Wussies! Some of my best experiences have come from backpacking and hitchiking and I highly reccomend it. Never, never let someone else define you. "Controversial?" No, we've never been controversial. But backpackers are a blank slate for feeble-minded passers-by to project their demons upon, and as a result backpackers sometimes become subject to violence by others. My wife's grandfather was born in Germany and got out of there before Adolph and his gang took over. She reminds me that alpine hiking has a European tradition that goes WAY back. It's what people have done for entertainment for hundreds of years. There is something basic and elemental about being self-contained, your home on your back, that has lasting appeal. I do not pretend to be an authority on backpacking, but I do know that the information in this section about its origins and history is a crock. Gregory Sweitzer, MSW, MA, Psy.D. gregsweitzer@yahoo.ca backpacker at large Toronto, Ontario, Canada

Because there's no date on this comment, it's hard to know whether it reflects the current article - but the origin you talk about here is more appropriate to Backpacking (wilderness). - DavidWBrooks 20:12, 21 February 2009 (UTC)

"trend of increasing usage of both electronic and offline travel guides"

An anonymous IP has included a paragraph from which the above phrase is taken, with reference to (prsumably his own) blog article expressing an opinion about how certain things have altered backpacking . It has been removed as being an essay that that is obvious (people find stuff now on smart phones but they didn't used to) and unsupported original research (because of that, their experience is cheapened). He/she wanted more explanation, so here you go. DavidWBrooks (talk) 14:24, 23 June 2009 (UTC)

Megaloping?

What's this megaloping? Most of the backpackers probably use only public transport like normal airlines, trains, buses and taxis. I guess that only a minority of them rents their own cars, boats or airplanes. And if someone does, wouldn't that be more like that "flashpacking" and not doing it just normal backpacking? JJohannes (talk) 11:50, 23 April 2010 (UTC)

I have removed it - hunting around found just one site that used the term, and it hasn't been active since 2007. If I have missed something please return it, but with some sort of reference. - DavidWBrooks (talk) 13:21, 23 April 2010 (UTC)

"Budget airlnies"

I suggest an edit for Line 24 Around the turn of the millennium, the increase of budget airlines and low-cost flights once contributed to this expansion, but economic recession and upward price pressure on ailine ticket prices is depressing this trend.

The "increase of budget airlines and low-cost flights" may still apply or not, but I think (in America at least) the cost of flying is prohibitive, regardless of whether it is high or not, thanks to the unending wars. QASIMARA

Couch Hopping

I suggest a section in "Varients" on Web sites for backpackers who are not travelling but want to invite backpackers into their homes see http://couchhopping.com/ . QASIMARA

External links

I noticed that the link to Wikitravel was restored. I disagree with this, as the link is to wikitravel's main page, covering all forms of travel, not just backpacking - this goes against the very first entry in the linkspam warning, which was also restored. That first warning states that any external links to be added should: "Be based wholly about the domain of backpacking (independent travel) and not other forms of travel,"

Instead of that link, I would suggest these two links:

The Urban backpacking entry at Wikitravel would seem to better meet the external link guidelines of WP:EL, as well as better meet the EL criteria in this article. The link would be:

• Urban backpacking travel guide from Wikivoyage

A second link I would recommend, is one to dmoz, as suggested as acceptable in WP:ELMAYBE as a neutral candidate for a link to a directory of websites or organizations. The link would be:

• Backpacking (travel) at Curlie

Comments on these links? --- Barek (talk • contribs) - 03:05, 4 October 2010 (UTC)

I'm the one who reverted and restored the External Links section. My reasoning was that, although this article's EL section gets vandalized frequently, we shouldn't remove the entire section. In fact, with the use of the "linkspam warnings" in the comments of the article code, we should be encouraging editors to provide relevant links. That being said, I 100% agree with the deletion of the WikiTravel link and the addition of the two that you've mentioned above.  Amit  ►  12:03, 4 October 2010 (UTC)

Edit notice

I'm fine with the shortened edit notice, but if we're again flooded with "here's my blog of when I went to Europe" can we revisit it, please? I think the reason it came into it's previous version was a consensus after much inappropriate, unencyclopedic content. There were many discussions/debates previously along the lines of "it doesn't say I can't post a link to my blog" so there was a consensus to explicitly say that. But maybe now that blogging is no longer the "it" thing, it will cease? I'm not sure. StarM 21:15, 13 January 2012 (UTC)

I must have been sleeping or something, because I don't remember the personal-blog thing being much of a problem. But certainly, if it does become a problem then we can/should make changes. - DavidWBrooks (talk) 21:34, 13 January 2012 (UTC)

They were. Will try to find diffs later. Right now I'm having so many issues, I think Wikipedia needs to go backpacking or take a timeout. Won't load history beyond 50 and I know there have been far more edits to this article StarM 22:57, 13 January 2012 (UTC)

That's OK, don't sweat it. Looking quickly through the old history, all I saw were some external links to "lots of details about my trip" sites, rather than inclusion in the article (which is what I thought you meant). There didn't seem to be too many of them to handle, though. - `DavidWBrooks (talk)

External links modified

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Updates

While much of this information remains accurate, I believe an inclusion of typical trip routes that backpacking tourists conduct would be beneficial to the audience. Though it is included that South East Asia has become a major hotspot for many backpackers, there is little mention of the routes/techniques used by backpackers. This article also speaks oh how backpacking constitutes working from the country that these travelers are currently located in, yet backpacking has become a very common method of traveling on vacation or holiday, not only as a sort of digital nomad. I believe there could be a section regarding the benefits of traveling in such a way and dive deeper into the ways that backpacking has developed as of late. Here are a couple ideas for sources:

“Backpacking Routes.” MyFunkyTravel, Jan. 2018, myfunkytravel.com/backpackingroutes.html.

Schwieters, Carly. “Best Backpacking Trips - Top 6 Routes| StudentUniverse Blog.” StudentUniverse Travel Blog, StudentUniverse Travel Blog, 1 Mar. 2018, www.studentuniverse.com/blog/adventure/backpacking-here-are-our-picks-for-the-top-6-routes.

By: Mango Tours INQUIRER.net U.S. Bureau / 12:51 AM May 03, 2016. “5 Benefits of Backpacking.” Inquirer Lifestyle 5 Benefits of Backpacking Comments, Mango Tours, 3 May 2016, lifestyle.inquirer.net/227899/5-benefits-of-backpacking/.

Any thoughts?

MattSpringer (talk) 16:58, 22 March 2018 (UTC)Matt Springer 3/22/2018

Retitle this page??

Shouldn't we redirect Backpacking(travel) to some sort of other page, call it "traveling light" or "low-budget travel"?

Backpacking has only recently as a word begun to be abused by people attempting to market to people who want to appear more adventurous than they are. It should be more clear that this article is not about backpacking, but about traveling. — Preceding unsigned comment added by Timdesuyo (talk • contribs) 07:20, 3 November 2018 (UTC)

Requested move 10 November 2019

The following is a closed discussion of a requested move. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made in a new section on the talk page. Editors desiring to contest the closing decision should consider a move review after discussing it on the closer's talk page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.

The result of the move request was: not moved - consensus against (closed by non-admin page mover) DannyS712 (talk) 20:42, 17 November 2019 (UTC)

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Backpacking (travel) → Backpacker tourism – This moved was previously performed unilaterally by User:Wikieditor600, with the reason given as "Correct terminology". But (1) the move was incomplete as it failed to rename the talk page, and (2) I think this warrants prior discussion. I've reverted the move, and filed it as an RM instead. I'm nominating this procedurally and abstain from !voting. Paul_012 (talk) 19:45, 10 November 2019 (UTC)

• Oppose "Backpacking" is IMHO the more common. I've never heard the second form. We have adequate disambiguation, the previous name was far more common as a link source, and it's amenable to the pipe trick. Andy Dingley (talk) 20:11, 10 November 2019 (UTC)
• Oppose for the reasons stated just above. - DavidWBrooks (talk) 21:16, 10 November 2019 (UTC)
• Support Every research paper I can find on the subject refers to it as "backpacker tourism". You can see this in a google search. Just beacause you haven't heard of it, it is not a reason to vote one way or the other - we aren't going to delete every article you have never heard of. This also puts the article title in-line with the dozens of Wikipedia articles relating to types of tourism, such as Agritourism, Alternative tourism, Atomic tourism, Business tourism, city tourism, Cultural tourism, Music tourism, Disaster tourism, etc... Wikieditor600 —Preceding undated comment added 21:27, 10 November 2019 (UTC)

• You claim that "Backpacker tourism" exists as a name and I'm happy to accept that, even though I've not seen it myself (maybe it's a regional thing?). But we care here about WP:COMMONNAME, and I really can't see that being met. Andy Dingley (talk) 21:58, 10 November 2019 (UTC)

• Oppose While I have not encountered the phrase backpacking tourism per se, I have encountered urban travelers referred to as backpackers so it stands to reason that backpacking tourism would be acceptable grammatically. Perhaps there is some parallel to the phrase camping being used in related but contradictory ways: 1) a minimalist-equipment philosophy of tents, portable cookers, sleeping bags, etc., or 2) a bring-everything-including-the-kitchen-sink in an RV. As a wilderness backpacker, I was seriously annoyed visiting (many decades ago) a franchise chain called "Camping World" which did not have freeze dried food, tent repair kits, handheld water treatment, etc. However, the suggested phrase has only 72,500 matches while "backpacking travel" has over a million. —EncMstr (talk) 21:39, 10 November 2019 (UTC)
• Oppose it is a scholarly term and one I'm relatively familiar with, but agree with @Andy Dingley: above re: CommonName. StarM 03:31, 13 November 2019 (UTC)

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The above discussion is preserved as an archive of a requested move. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made in a new section on this talk page or in a move review. No further edits should be made to this section.