Talk:Shoah (disambiguation)

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Judaism

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Why isn't this article a redirect to Holocaust?[edit]

Is there something that we anticipate covering here that would not belong in Holocaust? Will there be more detail here, so that this is a section breakout of the Holocaust article? If so, why isn't this linked from Holocaust? I don't object to a separate article, but I don't think "being the hebrew name for..." is enough to warrant a separate article. Thanks in advance. 64.254.131.102 18:04, 3 November 2005 (UTC)[reply]

I came to the talk page to post a similar comment. IMO, if this page exists at all, it should be about the word. The history of the Holocaust itself should appear under the name more familiar in English. --Delirium 07:47, 4 December 2005 (UTC)[reply]

I fully agree with y'all. Let's give it, say a few weeks wait to see if anyone can elaborate on the word. if nothing promising comes up, we can turn this into a redirect for holocaust and add a section about the meaning of "shoah" on the holocaust page.Shaggorama 09:22, 26 December 2005 (UTC)[reply]

Me too. I was about to start improving the 'beginnings' section (which is currently very poor) when I realised it would be a lot of work, and it would only duplicate material in the Holocaust article. --Squiddy | (squirt ink?) 10:27, 6 January 2006 (UTC)[reply]

Are Shoah and Holocaust synonymous, though? Or does Shoah just refer to the Jews killed?

No, they're not synonymous. Shoah refers refers to the genocide of the Jews, as Porajmos (a term that I think was inspired by the specificity of "Shoah") refers to the genocide of the Roma. If we had a separate Shoah article, it would I think be similar in scope to the Porajmos article. Of course, this would be complicated by the large overlap with the Holocaust article, as the Jewish experience figures (rightly, I think) very large in that article. Still, with care, I think a decent Shoah article could be realized, expanding on specific anti-Jewish actions and the lasting effects on the Jewish community.--Pharos 15:38, 27 January 2007 (UTC)[reply]

Also, much or all of History of the Jews during World War II should probably be merged here.--Pharos 21:39, 27 January 2007 (UTC)[reply]

The manner in which this topic was disambiguated is misleading. In the Hebrew Language, the term which is equivalent to the Germanic word Holocaust denotes a slaughter done for a greater purpose. The term Shoah is a Hebrew term which denotes the absence of everything, a slaughter for no greater purpose. Shoah should not require a user to manually redirect to Holocaust, if anything it should be inverted and The Holocaust should be made obsolete as a term, due to the inaccurate translational connotative effects on the term.

A legitimate compromise would be to have Shoah just redirect into the discussion on The Holocaust. That way readers can draw their own conclusions on the connotative relevance of each term AFTER they read about the cataclysmic event which devastated Jewish Culture. I look forward to discussing this before I unilaterally seek a redirect into Holocaust for the Shoah entry. DavoudMSA (talk) 01:11, 20 February 2008 (UTC)[reply]

Khurban Europa[edit]

Any thought to including the term Khurban Europa (I wish i could figure out how to type an "H" with a dot under it)?Benami 01:41, 10 January 2006 (UTC)[reply]

Other uses[edit]

Matan Vilnai was widely reported as refering to Israel's actions in the Gaza strip as a "Shoah" today "they (the Palestinians) will bring upon themselves a bigger shoah because we will use all our might to defend ourselves,". Arye Mekel, Israel's foreign ministry spokesman, said "Deputy Defence Minister Matan Vilnai used the Hebrew phrase that included the term 'shoah' in the sense of a disaster or a catastrophe, and not in the sense of a holocaust,". So does it just mean a disaster? --BozMo talk 09:49, 20 November 2012 (UTC)[reply]