Talk:Pro-Europeanism

Pro-European Parties

I'm wondering why it is necessary to list the pro-european parties from France and the UK. I understand that listing the parties from all the member states would make the article too long, but selecting France and the Uk seems arbitrary. I can understand mentioning the UK since it has a different political division on this issue. Also the vast majority of the political parties in the EU (exept for the UK) are pro-European. Maybe it would be better to make a list based on political views? Ive added Although the situation differs in each member state, in general, most political parties can be considered as being pro-European in varying degrees. The main exeptions being far left, far right and nationalist parties. Maybe it's to generalistic, let me know what you think!

i think within the country we should have disscusions on are thaughts then prosent them with all of the eu —Preceding unsigned comment added by 86.154.166.243 (talk) 15:13, 26 April 2008 (UTC)

Pro-European Links

I was very impressed by the number of sceptic links there are on the Eurosceptic page (I've added some myself), so I though it might be worth having a few pro-Europeans ones on this page too. Unfortunately, there a bit UK specific at the mo, so if others could broaden them that'd be great... - Tom

Reform of EU

I think a key part of any pro-European viewpoint must include an aim to improve and reform the EU. For example, I personally think CAP is a very expensive way to 'protect' food supplies and agricultural employment, and is highly damaging to some developing countries that rely heavily on agricultural exports. Does anyone know of good links on reform that could be added to the page? - Tom

The point

What's the point of this article when there's already a synonymous one? It also seems to be rather Britain-centric. --Shallot 16:15, 4 May 2004 (UTC)

Some people like Kenneth Clarke, consider themselves pro-European without the uncritical 'love' europhile might imply. Certainly there are more references in Wikipedia to Pro-European than to Europhile. That said, perhaps a redirect from one to the other might be appropriate as they are quite similar.

In terms of UK specific, it is, but a few contributions from others could broaden it to encompass other pro-European campaigns and political parties. --EuroTom 18:25, 4 May 2004 (UTC)

Redundancy

This page really should be here. There are lots of references to it in multiple pages and it isn't self-explanatory unless you view the EU as Europe (!)... --anon

Agreed, but perhaps the various pro-EU pages (this one, and Europhile, and any others that are hanging around) could be combined into one bigger page covering the various grades of pro-EU thought. A similar thing should be done with the various eurosceptic pages. Toby W 08:53, 22 Sep 2004 (UTC)

Odd sentence

I just tidied up a rather wordy intro but couldn't find a way to tidy up this sentence:

N.B. Whilst it is stated above that a pro-European position supports the EU, it does not necessarily follow that someone who may be labelled anti-European would be non-supportive of the EU.

I'm not sure what this means. It seems to be saying that pro-Europeans support the EU but anti-Europeans don't necessarily oppose it, but that can't be right because it's patently untrue. Any suggestions? Wombat 19:21, 15 Jan 2005 (UTC)

Merge Europhile to this article

The Europhile article is vague, and it is UK usage anyway. 'Pro-European' makes sense all over Europe, and is widely used.Paul111 11:22, 29 October 2006 (UTC)

I agree. —Nightstallion (?) 21:30, 12 November 2006 (UTC)

• Me too. Merge (and redirect) the UK variant into this. Marcus22 21:27, 4 November 2007 (UTC)

Flag

Isn't the flag upside down? —Preceding unsigned comment added by Boonk (talk • contribs) 19:41, 4 November 2007 (UTC)

Cleanup

As part of the necessary cleanup, I am removing this bit of unencyclopedic discussion of terminology, but I'll move it here first in case anyone thinks something can be saved from it. I suppose it might conceivably belong on Wiktionary.

In practice the term is used as a de facto antonym of eurosceptic. In turn anti-European and the pejorative Europhobe are synonyms of Eurosceptic, and Europhile is often seen as a pejorative term for a pro-European. Some Eurosceptics would describe themselves as "pro-European" in the sense that they are not anti-Europe or anti-EU per se, although they would clearly not identify themselves as being pro-European in the sense described in this article. The precise meaning of these terms is often dependent on the context.

--Boson (talk) 20:04, 2 December 2009 (UTC)

Is pro-Europeanism a political ideology?

I have long seen pro-Europeanism used in many infoboxes for political parties in the ideolgies section. As far as I was remember it had a few years ago been agreed and accepted that it is a political ideology. However a long time editor, @Hazhk:, removed this from the page Scottish Labour Party, claiming it is not a political ideology. Is there any current consensus on this? If it is not an ideology a lot of infoboxes will need changing because as far as I'm aware it was general consensus that this could be included, as it is used quite frequently in this section. As such would Euroscepticism also need removing? I could see this as being far more complex and less justified as a lot of parties are based mainly around this. As such if Euroscepticism is acceptable then I don't really see why pro-Europeanism isn't. Helper201 (talk) 17:43, 22 April 2018 (UTC)

Removing Pro-Europeanism from Parties' infobox

User:Nick.mon, User:Vif12vf, User:Scia Della Cometa, User:BrownHairedGirl, User:Autospark. User:Davide King, User:Broncoviz, User:AleCapHollywood, User:Egeymi, User:Yakme, User:Vacant0, User:Ermanarich, User:BastianMAT, User:Shadow4dark, User:The Account 2, User:Martopa, User talk:Braganza, User:Karma1998, User talk:Mureungdowon, User:Nick Number, User:Nick Number , User:Stevan Mitnick, User:Gorrrillla5, User:Skywatcher68 and User:Checco

I want to get a consensus to remove the Pro-Europeanism tag from all Parties' infobox because this tag is too generic and this tag's definition is undefined Pomchi-Inu87 (talk) 17:50, 26 January 2023 (UTC)

• Oppose: Most of the political parties listed here are well referenced within their "ideologies" section or their infobox's highlighting the party's "pro-European" stance/position. I believe this to be a matter of sourcing. I think you are better off placing WP:CITENEED tags in the articles where sources are non-existent. For the cases in which a particular party's views are ill-defined/or where WP:RS is lacking, taking it to the talk page(s) of those respective articles to discuss/seek consensus would be more appropriate. Considering each article is different, creating one mass rule-of-thumb to apply to all these articles (including the well sourced articles) doesn't particularly make sense. I think an individual, case-by-case approach is what's needed. Cheers, Archives908 (talk) 21:01, 26 January 2023 (UTC)

Comment: Also including HapHaxion and Charles Essie here as I see they had to restore several articles where Pomchi-Inu87 had already begun removing the ideology from articles prior to any consensus being reached. Archives908 (talk) 03:43, 27 January 2023 (UTC)

• Oppose: I agree with the reasoning of Archives908. User:ValenciaThunderbolt should also be made aware of this discussion based on his recent edits removing Pro-Europeanism from multiple infoboxes. Vif12vf/Tiberius (talk) 01:57, 27 January 2023 (UTC)

• Support: As it isn't an ideology and rather a stance, which can be incorporated into an article's ideology section (if not already), I support its removal. ValenciaThunderbolt (talk) 17:31, 27 January 2023 (UTC)

Comment: Its arguable that even "stances" are ideologically based in principal. Do you have any WP:RS which proves its categorically not an ideology? Several of these "pro-European" parties place closer European integration/development of ties with the EU/prospective EU membership as a goal prominently within their respective manifestos. In contrast, Euroscepticism has become a pretty prominent ideological stance of many parties in Europe, so why the double standard with "Pro-Europeanism" as an ideology? Archives908 (talk) 18:06, 27 January 2023 (UTC)

• Oppose I don't think that pro-Europeanism should be indicated in the infoboxes of all pro-European parties, but in some cases it is a distinctive feature of some parties, characterizing itself "de facto" as a political ideology.--Scia Della Cometa (talk) 13:10, 28 January 2023 (UTC)

• Support, enthusiastically. Pro-Europeanism and Euroscepticism are not ideologies, but policies. Political party infoboxes should contain only pure ideologies and, possibly, not more than two or three of them. Policies like pro-Europeanism, Euroscepticism, Atlanticism, Russophilia, anti-immigration and so on should not be among them. --Checco (talk) 20:56, 28 January 2023 (UTC)