Talk:Middelburg, Zeeland

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I am not sure about the dates mentioned in the article for the founding of the abbey or the granting of city rights to Middelburg.

--Martin Wisse 11:08, 11 Sep 2004 (UTC)

I cannot believe there is no mention of the slave trade. This stinks of bias. There is of course the description of how the Germans bombed Middelburg but there is no mention of the atrocities committed by the Dutch in their effort to profit from the slave trade...Hans in Holland.

The article needs better references. For instance for archeological evidence for the existence of an early 9th, or possibly late 8th, century walled settlement (Dutch) on the site of today's abbey: Heeringen, R.M. van; Henderikx, P.A. Vroeg Middeleeuwse Ringwalburgen in Zeeland. Goes, De Koperen Tuin. 1995. ISBN:90-72138-41-4. (Dutch) The early date for the founding of the abbey is unfamiliar to me but also reported in another online encyclopedia, in connection with the more familiar 1125 date. The following sentence is misleading: "Hundreds of thousands of African slaves were transported from Middelburg to North and South America, thus enriching local traders." Middelburg was certainly involved in slave trade, but no slaves were ever traded in Middelburg. Look here (Dutch, the archive of the province of Zeeland) for a short history of Middelburg's involvement in the slave trade. "Hundreds of thousands" is certainly exaggerated: 180.000 is the theoretical upper bound, if Middelburg is held responsible for all slaves sold by companies and individual merchants from the province of Zeeland, which is certainly not the case since the town of Vlissingen (note that slave trade isn't mentioned there) was certainly more important in the slave trade. "Tens of thousands" is closer to the truth. The section on "Zuid" is just silly. —Preceding unsigned comment added by (talk) 14:24, 3 March 2008 (UTC)

I think the person who wrote the above was correct. Is it okay if I have just removed that sentence about the slave trade? Fiffififf D. Dünngus (talk) 19:40, 20 May 2008 (UTC)

Climate section is ridiculously long[edit]

Way too expansive. I will add the climate chart for Vlissingen there, but the section needs to be shortened. --AlexanderVanLoon (talk) 10:45, 10 September 2013 (UTC)

Okay, I decided against adding the climate data for Vlissingen after reading the text on the climate which states that temperatures are quite different. There adding Vlissingen's data would be deceptive. --AlexanderVanLoon (talk) 10:51, 10 September 2013 (UTC)
It is long and unsourced. Pruning it to something more manageable might be good. CRwikiCA talk 18:07, 10 September 2013 (UTC)

External links modified[edit]

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Requested move 15 February 2021[edit]

The following is a closed discussion of a requested move. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made in a new section on the talk page. Editors desiring to contest the closing decision should consider a move review after discussing it on the closer's talk page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.

The result of the move request was: Consensus to move. (closed by non-admin page mover) SITH (talk) 15:07, 22 February 2021 (UTC)

– The town in South Africa has a population that's double that of the town in the Netherlands. Looking at pageviews, WP:NOPRIMARY and WP:WORLDVIEW seem to apply Park3r (talk) 09:39, 15 February 2021 (UTC)

  • Weak support Middelburg, Mpumalanga gets 1,493 while this one gets 2,001[[1]]. This one is a capital and its possible others are named after it though. Crouch, Swale (talk) 10:32, 15 February 2021 (UTC)
  • Support per nom.--Ortizesp (talk) 22:43, 15 February 2021 (UTC)
  • Comment I don't know much about the technicalities and don't care much about them either. The move may be the correct action based on the technical rules of WP. I just wanted to reinforce the observation made by Crouch, Swale above: the South Africa city is named after the original one in the Netherlands. Thank you, warshy (¥¥) 22:53, 15 February 2021 (UTC)
    • Since it has come up twice, I’ll point out that multiple sources state that Middelburg in South Africa was given that name because it is midway between Pretoria and Lydenburg. It doesn’t appear (perhaps surprisingly) to be directly named after the town in the Netherlands. It shouldn’t make a difference though, in this discussion (see WP:DPT, which specifically states "Being the original source of the name is also not determinative"). There are probably numerous examples of a second named place being the WP:PRIMARYTOPIC. Perth vs Perth, Scotland is an example that comes to mind.Park3r (talk) 16:28, 16 February 2021 (UTC)
      • I'd note that there are other places like Middelburg, South Holland and others listed on the Dutch Wikipedia DAB page in the Netherlands as well as at GeoNames so anyway its not clear that all uses derive from this one, even if the Mpumalanga one does. And on that note moved to Middelburg, Zeeland to avoid a PDAB and Nl uses "Zeeland". There also seems to be a 3rd in Gelderland though Google Maps doesn't show much. Crouch, Swale (talk) 17:22, 16 February 2021 (UTC)
        • I believe the relationship of the Middelburg, Zeeland, and Amsterdam in the Dutch Golden Age of the 17th century is similar to the later relationship between Middelburg and Pretoria, for the Dutch settlers in the 19th century. warshy (¥¥) 17:56, 16 February 2021 (UTC)

The discussion above is closed. Please do not modify it. Subsequent comments should be made on the appropriate discussion page. No further edits should be made to this discussion.

Middelburg, Netherlands[edit]

I guess the article was moved to Middelburg, Netherlands by mistake, seeing as it has now within a day been moved to Middelburg, Zeeland. Unfortunate, as the many hundreds of links that were fixed by me and a few others are now broken yet again.

I propose, however, to let Middelburg, Netherlands redirect here. Middelburg, Zeeland is the clear primary topic within the Netherlands; there is no comparison between the Zeeland city and the South Holland village by any metric, whether it's pageviews, historical importance, current importance, number of pages that link to it or anything else you could think of. A simple hatnote (Middelburg, Netherlands redirects here; for the village in South Holland, see Middelburg, South Holland) will suffice in case anyone is ever looking for the village. Lennart97 (talk) 17:20, 23 February 2021 (UTC) (Edited to add: I think a good comparison, for example, is how Phoenix, United States redirects to Phoenix, Arizona and not to Phoenix#United States, even though there are plenty of other places in the US called Phoenix.) Lennart97 (talk) 17:34, 23 February 2021 (UTC)