Talk:Spaghetti junction

Golden Glades Interchange

A clarification: the people near the Golden Glades Interchange informally refer to it as "The Spaghetti Bowl." B.Wind 10:15, 2 December 2006 (UTC)

Proposed merge

Disagree. There are many 'spaghetti junctions' outside the US, and there are many which are NOT known at all as (a) 'Malfunction Junction' Midlandstoday 21:12, 26 February 2007 (UTC)

Also disagree, as above. Andy Mabbett 22:08, 26 February 2007 (UTC)

I also disagree - I think the tag should be removed PMBO 16:37, 6 March 2007 (UTC)

I have now removed the tag as per the comments above. Midlandstoday 14:57, 9 March 2007 (UTC)

Someone has re-added the proposed merger tag, now dated October 2012. The above reasons for not merging all still stand, so I removed. Perhaps the intro could be more emphatic about the term being proper noun (the name of a specific location)? I think it's already clear enough, but are some people are taking it to be a generic term? For instance, the Gravelly Hill Interchange is not referred to as "a" spaghetti junction, it is Spaghetti Junction. I know that, but does the article make it absolutely clear? --PRL1973 (talk) 10:15, 29 October 2012 (UTC)

Springvale Junction

I don't think springvale junction belongs in this category. It's not really an intersection between multiple major highways, just a very congested / poorly managed intersection of two main roads within a major city. I think it can be removed from this category. 203.11.72.4 06:08, 30 March 2007 (UTC)

I agree. All the other junctions have multiple grade separated ramps that resemble spaghetti. Springvale Junction is a busy at grade light controlled intersection. Is there any verified local usage? I propose to remove it. In the meantime I have added the words "at grade" to the entry. --Rodin5 (talk) 00:09, 26 March 2009 (UTC)

Definition of "Spaghetti Junction"

There are several interchanges listed here which appear to be standard stack, stack DDI, Y, parclo, etc. interchanges. Are we going to permit anything where an editor says "the locals call it 'spaghetti'" or are we going to restrict this to interchanges with a relatively unique characteristic? Items I have issues with are:

• Kreuz Kaiserberg in Duisburg, Germany
• I55 / I90 / I94 in Chicago, IL - 2lvl Stack
• I15 / I515 / US 93 / US 95 in Las Vegas, NV - 3lvl Stack
• E.B. Cloete Interchange (N2/N3) in Durban, South Afrika - 4lvl Stack (assuming I'm looking at the right one, which appears to be the most complicated in the area)
• I20 / I59 / I65 in Birmingham, AL - Stack DDI

--Bossi (talk ;; contribs) 19:07, 1 April 2007 (UTC)

Hmmm, this article seems to be becoming a list of anyone's local 'big' motorway/freeway junction. Should this be only for junctions actually called 'spaghetti'? At the moment there's junctions on here which haven't even been built yet, never mind earned a nickname. Midlandstoday 19:35, 30 October 2007 (UTC)

I've noted I-55/90/94 to be called the Spaghetti Junction by local media sources, notably WGN-TV. However, other sources (Chicagopedia among them) say the Circle Interchange is the Spaghetti Junction (or Spaghetti Bowl), and I have never heard that in modern usage. Not really sure how to resolve this difference. —Rob (talk) 20:07, 30 October 2007 (UTC)

I agree with excluding standard examples, even if locals think the interchange is intimidating. Some possible criteria for uniqueness I'd offer are more than two roadways in the junction, exits on unexpected sides, braided ramps, collector/distributor roadways, and extra loops. Msramming (talk) 23:31, 23 June 2017 (UTC)

Since "traffic circles" are less common in the US, these highway interchanges, when more complex, are also referred as "Circle interchanges", which in Chicago, gave the original and adjacent U of Illinois "Congress Circle Campus" (official '60s name) later known as Chicago Circle Campus (official '70s-'90s campus name)and now UI-Chicago (UIC), it's official and locally used name. Should reference to an "Expressway Circle {Highway interchange}" or something similar, also be indexed on this page? ChgoJohn, new at this commenting ChgoJohn (talk) 18:36, 6 November 2022 (UTC)

Bruckner Interchange

Why hasn't anybody here considered adding the Bruckner Interchange to this list? ---- DanTD 03:32, 27 August 2007 (UTC)

• Added. I must say that most of the other interchanges in the list are quite simple in comparison to those found in New York City. --99.164.82.214 (talk) 21:58, 17 April 2008 (UTC)

Springvale junction isn't an interchange between highways and there is nothing spaghetti-like about it as it doesn't have slip lanes etc... In fact it has traffic lights! It's just a really congested traffic blackspot. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 220.239.209.2 (talk) 05:03, 11 August 2008 (UTC)

Organization and merges with Malfunction Junction

It seems to me that the lists of interchanges should be organized better. Right now I can't find any apparent sort method as to where interchanges are mentioned. Also, it would be very helpful if these listings had links to a Google Maps view of the interchange.

As well, it appears that the article Malfunction Junction is a very similar article, and should somehow either be merged into this article, or be properly renamed, to something like "List of Confusing Interchanges in the United States". —Preceding unsigned comment added by Katsuki (talk • contribs) 22:25, 1 July 2009 (UTC)

So, an article originally about a junction actually called "Spaghetti Junction", which then became a list of junctions worldwide known by that name, which then sprawled into a list of every damn junction in the entire world that somebody somewhere considers complicated; should be renamed "List of Confusing Interchanges in the United States"? No. How about deleting off the list all the junctions that no more than about 2 people have ever called 'spaghetti'- hell, I'll do it. Midlandstoday (talk) 15:27, 30 October 2009 (UTC)

I agree, in my opinion a "spaghetti junction" refers to a complicated and non-symmetrical, "tangled" or "untidy" interchange. Impressive but not tangled, untidy or asymmetrical interchanges, such as 4-level stacks are not usually refered to spaghetti junction. —Preceding unsigned comment added by 82.32.72.129 (talk) 22:17, 1 October 2010 (UTC)

History of the Phrase

In Louisville, Kentucky, the junction between I-64, I-65, and I-71 has been referred to as "Spaghetti Junction" since the opening of the John F. Kennedy Memorial Bridge (I-65), which connects downtown Louisville to Jeffersonville, Indiana, in early 1964. This was long before any journalist in Birmingham would have printed it in the 1970s. — Preceding unsigned comment added by 74.132.119.36 (talk) 21:35, 25 September 2011 (UTC)

If you can find a reliable source to prove this, it can go in the article. -- Dr Greg  talk  22:03, 25 September 2011 (UTC)

Proposal to merge with Spaghetti Bowl (transportation)

I propose this merger because Spaghetti Bowl (transportation) expands on the USA examples in Spaghetti Junction. I would suggest it would be simpler to incorporate Spaghetti Bowl's info into the USA section of Spaghetti Junction and add a redirect from Spaghetti Bowl (transportation) to Spaghetti Junction. — Preceding unsigned comment added by Videomaniac29 (talk • contribs) 03:45, 11 October 2012 (UTC)

Seems reasonable to me. -- Dr Greg  talk  21:53, 17 October 2012 (UTC)

Disagree. Spaghetti junction is the primary term and I think spaghetti bowl should just be deleted entirely, any relevant facts can be incorporated into there and maybe a one line note added to the beginning of the article but the article is so useless it doesn't deserve the honor of being merged. Just strip it and shut it down 24.136.136.42 (talk) 05:12, 22 October 2012 (UTC)

Disagree with primary as "Junction" Junction is more used in the US for rail crossings (and esp. only in the US SE), not for highway crossongs, and it's use here on highways (in Utah, @laska, and in Ca, as "freeway junctions") are rare enough to warrant pages for those exceptional US uses. I suggest vernacular uses be sorted out on an existing page https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Interchange_(road) While this page and a similar one refocus on only definition of Spaghetti Bowl -OR- to the references to its common uses (and regardless of purity or dimensionality/stacking v flatness of that actual use). Since "traffic circles" are less common in the US, these highway interchanges, when more complex, are also referred as "Circle interchanges", which in Chicago, gave the original "U of Illinois "Congress Circle Campus" ('60s) later known as Chicago Circle Campus ('70s-'90s), and now UI-Chicago (UIC) it's (prior) official names. Should reference to an "Expressway Circle {Highway interchange}" or something similar, also be indexed on this page? ChgoJohn (talk) 18:51, 6 November 2022 (UTC)

Purpose of page

This page seems to be turning into a general list of large motorway junctions. If that's what it's going to be then it should be moved to a more representative title and clear criteria for inclusion should be established. If it is to remain as I think it was originally intended - as a list of junctions called "Spaghetti Junction" or similar - then we really ought to limit it to junctions where there is some form of source to back up their inclusion. At the moment it just seems to be a pointless chaos. JimmyGuano (talk) 07:31, 5 October 2013 (UTC)

I agree. I don't really see the point of a list of large junctions (and if there were to be such a list you'd need some specific criterion for inclusion). There is, arguably, some point to a list of junctions called "spaghetti", but there should be sources to prove the name, and that's why I tagged the article with {{refimprove}} recently. As far as I can tell, only three junctions currently have references to prove this (I exclude the Google Maps references that prove only that the junction exists and make no reference to "spaghetti"). My suspicion is that many of those currently listed here aren't called "spaghetti". There have been many recent additions by a single user Heff01 (talk · contribs), tripling the size of the article over the last month, and I've invited him or her to join this discussion. -- Dr Greg  talk  13:53, 5 October 2013 (UTC)

Agree. I will rate as list class and we need inclusion criteria. Widefox; talk 10:20, 20 January 2014 (UTC)

Trimming

I'm in the process of removing entries that are unsourced or have no indication of being called "spaghetti junction". Many of these are just standard stack interchanges, airport access roads, etc. –dlthewave ☎ 12:12, 14 April 2019 (UTC)

Move discussion in progress

There is a move discussion in progress on Talk:Gravelly Hill Interchange which affects this page. Please participate on that page and not in this talk page section. Thank you. —RMCD bot 10:47, 24 April 2022 (UTC)