Talk:National League System

Football: England / English non-league Mid‑importance

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Editorial Issue[edit]

The organisation section contains the text "promoand". It seems to me that a chunk of text has been accidentally deleted. I'm afraid I was reading it for information and have no idea what the missing text might have been. — Preceding [[Wikipedia:Signatures|Bob Wikicont (talk) 17:34, 11 November 2017 (UTC)]] comment added by Bob Wikicont (talk • contribs) 17:28, 11 November 2017 (UTC)[reply]

Redundant page[edit]

Hi, I only discovered Wikipedia's coverage of football competitions today. There seems to be a real effort to orgainse all this. With that in mind, may I suggest that this page is a bit redundent? The majority of it just repeats the content of English football league system (though sometimes in more detail). May I suggest that this page is merged with English football league system? After all, the National League System is only really a subdivision of the English league system. Should I be bold? —The preceding unsigned comment was added by 80.225.12.19 (talk • contribs) 14:15, 10 April 2004 (UTC).[reply]

The National League System is the page that introduces non-league football and I see no reason to remove it. In my opinion, if anything needs changing it is the English football league system page. It makes more sense to me - and I have it on my To Do list - to merge that page into a new Football in England page, which can then act as the overview of not just league football in England but cup football and any other relevant content. A Football in England page could provide a good basic introduction to the topic, including most of the content on the existing English football league system page, and pointers to articles for more detail on, for example, The Football Association, The Football League, the FA Premier League, the English national football team, and indeed the National League System, etc. There is already a Soccer in the United States and a Soccer in Canada page, though they need developing. This kind of general introduction seems to me to be the model to follow. Is there really a need for a page to introduce the league system separate from one to introduce football in England as a whole? - Madw 16:54, Apr 10, 2004 (UTC)

I think (and I'm not the same person who wrote the first comment) that there's room for all three pages. You're right that the National League System needs its own page, acting as an introduction to non-league football and providing more info on those leagues than the English football league system.

However, I believe that the English football league system page should stay as it is too important to be merged into a general article. You'll see that while there is a page on Soccer in the United States, there is also a page on the United States soccer league system (though again it needs expanding). There's also pages on the Welsh, Scottish and Italian football league systems (League system acts as an index).

The Football in England page sounds like a great idea. It would be good to have an overview of English football. The English football league system should be one of the articles it points to (along with the ones you listed above). The page is only meant to be an overview, so it shouldn't go into heaps of depth about the league system. 62.64.231.121 22:34, 10 Apr 2004 (UTC)

I'm OK about leaving the English football league system page up for now until after a Football in England page gets set up and we can review the situation then - I still wonder whether there might just be too much repetition but we can put that decision off for now. I was thinking about changing the currect English football league system links into Football in England#League system links so that there could still be a direct link to league system info. What do you think? By the way, I assume User 62.64.231.121 is the one who has been doing much to improve the English football pages, but why don't you log in with an ID? - Madw 00:06, Apr 11, 2004 (UTC)

I'm on dialup so I have many different IPs. I may well get an account at some point. It won't be for a while as I'll soon be leaving for somewhere where I won't have a permanent Internet connection. Also, I don't like registering for things! It's not just doing anonoymous edits (I certainly haven't done all the recent ones). I think Wikipedia attracts a lot of casual editors. 80.225.14.49 00:42, 11 Apr 2004 (UTC)

PS - The very fact that the English football league system links would have to be changed to an anchor proves that it needs its own page! I'd imagne that the league system section of Football in England would only need to say that there is a series of leagues (naming the Premier and Football Leagues) with promotion and relegation between them, then pointing the reader to English football league system for a fuller explanation.

I originally created this page under the name Football pyramid and noted the official name "National League System" secondarily.However,it seems clear that the English football league system extends both above AND BELOW what is considered to be the NLS,and the seven steps that are the official NLS do NOT include all the "40,000 clubs in 2,200" leagues that are mentioned in the article that got renamed from pyramid to NLS.While the four "league" divisions might be said to be part of the football league system but not of the pyramid,the pyramid as a whole is I dare say MOSTLY the amateur leagues below "Step 7".There are 25 leagues (or actually divisions) in Steps 1-5.Add the 19 in Step 6,and 41 in Step 7,and you get 85 out of the 2,200.If this article is going to focus on the NLS rather than the entire pyramid,the all-inclusive language needs to be deleted or moved elsewhere.--Louis E./12.144.5.2/le@put.com

Removed a comment that seemed to be by an angry Wimbledon FC fan, but turns out to be the only remnant of a paragraph about non-profesionalism. Feel free to restore (the paragraph, not the comment). 82.161.17.100 00:14, 20 Mar 2005 (UTC)

I feel that wherever possible, this article should restrict itself to infomation about the leagues at the seven levels covered. Any general infomation should be placed over at English football league system, and the reader reffered there when required. Tompw 10:19, 30 March 2006 (UTC)[reply]

I agree with Tompw. This article should focus on the 1 to 7 steps of the league system. Any leagues outside of this system (including the FA Premier League) should be mentioned in the English football league system. --S iva1979^{Talk to me} 20:08, 19 April 2006 (UTC)[reply]

Missing league?[edit]

Is the Nottinghamshire Senior League part of the National League System? This website [1] states that it is. If so, we should include this in the table. Any official conformation about this? Moreover, this website [2] states that it is a level 13 league under the name of (Powerleague) Nottinghamshire Alliance. Anyone clear of this? --S iva1979^{Talk to me} 09:11, 20 April 2006 (UTC)[reply]

The short answer is no, the Notts Senior League is not part of the National League System. The NLS only covers leagues down to level 11 (or step 7), and as you rightly point out, the Notts Senior League is at level 13. However, it is part of the English football league system. Hope this answers your question. Tompw 19:57, 20 April 2006 (UTC)[reply]

It's slightly more confusing than that - the Nottinghamshire Alliance (of three divisions, Senior, One and Two) disbanded in 2004, and was replaced by a new league, the (uhlsport) Nottinghamshire Senior League of a single division (well plus a reserve division, but we'll let that pass). I don't believe there is a formal arrangement with the Central Midlands League, so it would be as the same status as the (Lincolnshire Echo) Lincolnshire League fchd 21:16, 20 April 2006 (UTC)[reply]

Incorrect information?[edit]

I believe that the West Sussex Football League is in the incorrect section of the table. It is a level 12 league, therefore it should NOT be in the step 7 (or level 11) section of the table. This also applies to the English football league system table. Do you think I should change it? --S iva1979^{Talk to me} 16:51, 3 May 2006 (UTC)[reply]

The Sussex situation is tricky because the Sussex County League, unlike most Step 5 leagues, has three divisions extending down to Step 7. Until Steps 5-7 are fully reorganized, there will be some incongruities like this. Right now there is no Step 6 league in Essex or in Kent, but a suitable club from the Essex Olympian League or Kent County League could step up directly to Step 5 (or as we have seen with Beaumont Athletic, a club from outside the NLS entirely). In the Midlands, the Leics Senior League is Step 7 despite directly promoting to the Midland Alliance along with the Midland Combination and the West Midlands Regional League, which are both Step 6. It may not belong at Level 11 in the English football league system page, but it is definitely a Step 7 league. It's very possible that the SCL Division 3, Wessex Div 3, and Spartan SM Div 2 clubs will be dispersed among more "normal" Step 7 leagues sometime in the next few years anyway, which will raise the Sussex Step 7 leagues to normal level 11 practical status. --Balerion 01:28, 25 July 2006 (UTC)[reply]

History of the National League System[edit]

I've started an article at User:Sjorford/History of the National League System, which I'll move into the main namespace once I've completed the first good draft. Corrections, additions, suggestions all welcome. — sjorford ++ 10:13, 24 May 2006 (UTC)[reply]

Notable clubs?[edit]

Now, I feel that it is time to make ALL Level 7 clubs in the National League System as being inherently notable. In the near future, I am planning to create lots of articles on these clubs. As you all know, I took a long wikibreak because most of my articles on non-league football clubs got deleted due to notability issues. This forced me to rethink my role as an editor to wikipedia for a couple of months. Almost one year later, I feel that it is time to rethink our stand on non-league football clubs by making ALL of these level 7 clubs notable. These clubs deserve to have articles about them. Any opinions on this matter would be appreciated. --S iva1979^{Talk to me} 10:35, 21 May 2009 (UTC)[reply]

No. Please no. No clubs, nor anythnig else on that matter, should be inherently notable. If a club passes WP:N and you can demonstrate multiple, non-trivial coverage in reliable sources, then it deserves an article, whether it plays at Step 1, Step 7 or whatever. If it doesn't pass WP:N, then an article shoudl be deleted. - fchd (talk) 10:43, 21 May 2009 (UTC)[reply]

Non-League football[edit]

The Non-League football article is rather sad and neglected. Would it be appropriate to merge it with this article? Longwayround (talk) 09:59, 16 December 2011 (UTC)[reply]

Step 5 to step 4 promotion criteria[edit]

Does anyone know if one of the criteria for promotion has been changed for this season? I've seen a couple of references to the finishing position which suggest that it must now be top two positions. (It's stated to be any of first three places in this document). The two references I've seen are 2015–16 Northern Football League in the remark about Bishop Aukland immediately above the Division One table, and [3] just before the list of clubs.Drawoh46 (talk) 05:11, 14 April 2016 (UTC)[reply]

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Please contribute to the Move Discussion at National League[edit]

There is a move discussion at National League, the USA baseball page, over moving that to a disambiguation page. Part of the reason for this move would be to avoid editors trying to find this page from ending up at a baseball page by mistake. Please contribute. Mountaincirque^talk 13:03, 2 May 2023 (UTC)[reply]